So Serious
An Interview with Hip Hop Chess Federation Co-Founder Adisa Banjoko
By Shamako Noble

Adisa Banjoko is serious. He's serious about religion, martial arts, military strategy and chess. He's serious about his family and his soccer team. And he was serious about this interview.

Recently Adisa has been riding the wave of support that has come off the heels of developing and launching the worlds first Hip Hop Chess Federation. With RZA and Josh Waitzkin on board, Adisa and his partner Leo Librian have been sky rocketing towards success. We sat down with Adisa to dig into the mind of the man behind the boards, and see what's really crackin.

SN: So my first question is this: This whole Hip Hop and Chess thing has taken off way faster and way harder than could have been previously imagined. To what do you credit such a rapid climb?

Adisa: The HHCF has indeed taken off fast. Much faster than I ever could have anticipated. We just opened up an office in Romania! We have offers to come out to Spain and Malaysia...But, to answer your question, I think timing is right. Hip Hop, chess and the martial arts communities have all matured to a point where so many can see the connections.

At the same time, people are tired of the violence being reflected in the youth and folks want answers. The HHCF is not a cure-all for all of societies problems. But we can, and do make an impact where we can.

SN: What do you think the HHCF contributes the Hip Hop and the Chess landscape that it was lacking before your existence?

Adisa: The HHCF was able to dispel two negative stereotypes about both subcultures. For the Hip Hop community, we crushed the stereotype of the ignorant, dumb rapper. We showed an authentic intelligence within Hip Hop that always existed and did not have a political or religious dogma attached to it. So that's beautiful.

On the other side of the coin, we have the stereotype of the eternal chess nerd. People always wanted to act like chess players have no flavor, no personal style. We broke barriers on that one as well. The destruction of stereotypes is key to creating intercultural communication. That's what our organization facilitates. Its something hard for people visualize, so just peep:

SN: You've been chronicling the Bay Area experience for many years now. Tell me, how would you summarize the changes that you've seen, and what are some of your predictions for the next 3-5 years?

Adisa: The Bay went from being on the verge of a new global explosion with hyphy, to being back on solo with no promo. I hate it too, because I feel like the majors killed hyphy off prematurely because they did not understand it.

At the same time, one of the problems in exporting hyphy was the car culture. All through the Bay sideshows evolved over the last 20 years. But in Colorado or NY, cats will catch serious felonies trying to ghostride anything. When so much of the music was connected to things other folks were not able to do-it made it harder for hyphy to grow...That's why I suggested in Lyrical Swords Vol. 2: Westside Rebellion that they LEGALIZE the sideshows....But, cats thought I was trippin'. I was trying to set up the export of the car culture so the whole Bay could blow.

It does not matter really. The Bay is so raw. There is so much MC, DJ, b-boy/b-girl, graf and journalism talent that we will always be a factor in the game.

SN: All right, so this is an obvious one: Who are you supporting for President? What other races, if any, will you be watching closely?

Adisa: Well, it USED to be obvious. I was 100% for Obama. Then he got all silent on the Jena 6 issue. I thought he was supposed to be the NEW ERA politician. If that's the case then why the silence?

So, now I'm reconsidering Hillary. She's always hardcore. Plus, the idea of having Bill anywhere near the Oval Office again hypes me up. But I do respect Hillary on her own merits. At the same time, it's SO hard for me to get passed the fact that she voted for the war. It really bothers me. So, I don't know.

I am a registered voter, and I vote as often as I can on everything I can. But I do not believe in one approach to politics. I think you have to vote, march, write letters, sign petitions, protest peacefully and switch things up to force change. There is too much bureaucracy in today's government. That's why I believe in donating time to kids. Beyond the HHCF I coach soccer, and I just love kids. I love inspiring kids to believe in themselves. I believe in donating my time, and my mind to the kids. I'm becoming less faithful in politics (but staying political) and putting more time in trying to pass on positivity to the youth.

SN: What were you're thoughts on the Jena six situation and the general response to it? Where do you think this whole scenario is headed?

Adisa: I am happy to see how it motivated the Hip Hop community to action. At the same time, it's going to take a lot more than a big march and a few rappers showing up to change the overall situation. I can't say where it's all headed because the sincerity of everyone at the top has not been determined yet. The bottom line though, is that America is far off from having solved her race issue. Hopefully, now we can have more serious, honest dialogue as a Nation.

SN: You're at the nexus of the conversation about Hip Hop and Islam. What role do you think religion and spirituality has played in Hip Hop in general (Abrahamic faiths and others) and what role has it played for you personally?

Adisa: Indeed, I was one of the first people to actively document the relationship between Hip Hop and Islam. I think the only other person to take it seriously was Harry Allen. He did a great piece for BBC Radio called "The Mic, The Star & The Crescent". It was very powerful. But both of my books in the Lyrical Swords series have chapters that deal with Hip Hop & Islam. Personally, I was on a self-destructive path before Islam. My parents were Christians, but they opened the door for me to observe all faiths. They planet the seeds, Hip Hop watered the soil.

Whether or not most people know it, Islam is the unofficial religion of Hip Hop. Let us be clear, a lot of Hip Hop is downright immoral. That's not what I'm talking about. When serious ethical questions arise, Islam is the moral compass of the Hip Hop community. Some would try to argue that case...But the truth is, that when conflict comes up, the Muslims are the ones to organize the peace treaties. When you look at the songs that celebrate respect for the women in Hip Hop- who did it? Muslims like Kam, PRT, PE, Paris, T-K.A.S.H., Amir Sulaiman they are the ones carrying the torch of respect for women in rap. That is something that has been long overlooked when discussions of sexism arise. I could go on and on, but, this subject is a huge section of Lyrical Swords Vol. 3, due out late 2008. SoundSlam: How did you feel about Kanye vs. Curits? Did you trip out when everyone started calling 50 cent Curtis?

Adisa: 50 Cent is one of the smartest people in Hip Hop. However, people are so busy being mad at him that they can't see his strategic wisdom. In Hip Hop people change names all the time. Tupac to Makavelli, B.I.G. to Frank White, E-40 to Charlie Hustle, Puff Daddy to Diddy- it's all good. Curtis is a name Cam'ron started calling him to undermine him. 50 embraced the name Curtis and took Cams power away. It was classic. Both of these guys are hot but for different reasons. I know 50 is probably frustrated by the fact that Kanye got him. But if you look at their fan base, Kanye was kinda born to win this.

What do I mean?

Well, 50 is a product of the streets who had hunger on the mic so heavy he took over the game. The streets loved him. But in his growth he transcended the streets and became a pop icon. Let me say that again. 50 became a pop icon. Kanye also became a pop icon. But this was his goal. He diversified his sound from deep soul, to gospel to raw dance music. This gave him a much deeper fan base than 50. As 50's fame grew, his fan base on the block hit its maximum level. But I don't think there were enough of his Pop fan base there to make up for maxing out on the block. Kanye has pure gospel fans who love him. Kanye has straight dance music fans that love him and he has Hip Hop fans. 50 moved to work with Justin and Timbaland to cut into Kanye's base, but there was too much diversity on Kanye's side.

So, this loss to Kanye was not a musical error, but a tactical one. If 50's first single was produced by Dre and feat. Em on the hook- he'd have killed Ye. Because Dre is an icon beyond all borders. What I think is real sad, is that 50 made peace with Jim Jones, Juelz and never let the comp with Kanye get street. But he gets no credit for being a peacemaker...No credit for keeping this Kanye issue artistic. Now, had he said after seeing he lost to Ye in sales "I'm cappin' Ye on site"- he'd be on the cover of almost every mag in America . But he makes peace with hardcore enemies and the mainstream press ignores him.

This signals to me that the mainstream media loves to see Black men in conflict with one another, much more than it can celebrate peace between brothers. So much media hypes up rap beefs its real tragic. For rap media specifically to play such a major role in hyping beef, it just angers me. Virtually all Hip-Hop media have become advocates of Black stereotypes, not destroyers of Black stereotypes.

I personally, have a new admiration for 50 and Kanye through this last situation.

SN: You're from San Jose and have seen what's going down with police accountability issues in the Zae'. What are your thoughts on that, and where do you think that this is all headed?

Adisa: I think that the police departments across the nation are in disarray. But there are several factors going on here. The first is that I think many police are not properly trained in how to subdue a person without extreme violence. Many of these guys are out of shape and ignorant of many of the cultural factors that dictate how various citizens may act. That alone contributes to tons of police brutality. On another level, our inner cities are in shambles. We used to live in a time when people policed their own communities. We have gotten away from that. Because this is the case, police officers are overworked, underpaid and undereducated.

But then we brag about not snitching. Look, everybody should know how to mind his or her own business on certain issues. At the same time, why would I protect someone who is trying to pimp my daughter? What honor is there in being quiet about the man who is selling heroin to my cousin or guns to my sons? Our elders deserve peace. They just had a situation where some high school football players saw an elderly man getting robbed. The whole team chased these guys down and contained them till the cops came. I wish I were rich. I'd give all them kids 20 grand if I could. That is a style of honor that is missing in most of America .

Dudes complain about police being in their hoods too much but drive with 40 ounces and chronic in their lap. They say they are being profiled and drive with no tags on their jeep and beat up on their lady. Then when the cops come they get mad. If you ain't living right- the cops gonna come for you. So with these dope dealers and pimps you got two choices. You can go to the cops-or you can get these predators of our people out yourself. In various Muslim communities, they have been very successful at getting dope dealers and pimps to leave the area. I am not a suggesting that I support being a vigilante. What I am suggesting is that by having a higher level of moral dignity in our poverty, we can help find internal solutions that do not require police to even be in our neighborhoods. Police your own actions, live life clean and you will have more on your side when and if police do you unjustly.

SN: Recently, Chamillionare stated that he was going to release a record that didn't have any curse words or the use of the N word on it. This was something that you wrote about a little less than two years ago. Do you feel vindicated and do you think that this move will pay off for Chamillionare?

Adisa: I wish more people would take Cham's path. I'm down for free speech, but I hate it when my favorite MC's curse on the mic. There is so much conscious Hip Hop that my kids cannot listen to because the N word and curse words are all through it. If these politically minded rappers are making music for the people- then stop cursing please. Malcolm, Che, MLK and Mandela never needed to curse to go head up with their opponents. They did it with such mental clarity that cursing was not needed. Let's just leave it there.

Also, let it be known that privately I curse a lot. But it does not make me a hypocrite to not curse when I'm doing a lecture at Harvard or Brown. It makes me intelligent. All styles of speech are not meant for all places.

SN: Tell us about your relationship with the Commonwealth Club. What makes this relationship significant, and what can folks in the Hip Hop community learn from it if anything.

Adisa: The Commonwealth Club is an organization that hosts lectures and panel discussions with the hardest political, social and cultural heavyweights. They bring everybody from RZA, to Jimmy Carter to the creators of Youtube out and host open discussions. They are sponsoring our panel at the Oct. 13th Tournament. It's an honor to be teamed up with them.

SN: Any final thoughts.

Adisa: I just want to say thanks for interviewing me. I encourage people to come out and kick it on Feb. 16th at the Queens Invitational . We expect about 300 folks out. I hope at least that make it out. I also want to say that nonviolence is a real thing, and I hope to make more of it manifest in Hip Hop through the HHCF. Oh, much love to HHCF cofounder Leo Libiran, Me'ko, D'Lamont, Dr. Kirshner, RZA, Josh Waitzkin and all the folks who have contributed to our existence. All you college folks, if you want a brotha to come crush your podium, hit me up at bishop@lyricalswords.com.